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Old June 26th, 2011, 11:35 AM   #21 (permalink)
preston preston is offline
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by srimonogramming
We don't run many jobs around more than one revolution, but when we do, I manually do a revolver mode while our press is running and can turn printheads on and off easily. Others I've seen try to do this struggle and can't quite keep up with the correct sequencing and end up printing colors at the wrong time. With all that being said, I think it's still a patent(able) device, it doesn't matter that people were doing it, manually or on an auto, they didn't apply for a patent for the program to control the actions so that's not really going to fly in court. That won't stand up in court as prior art is what I'm trying to say. I've got my cousin looking at this in his spare time, he is a patent attorney so I'll likely have a pretty rock solid opinion on this after I talk to him sometime this week.

I read the patent and if you can even make sense of the gooblygoc wording used I never saw one thing about revolving. The only thing I saw was about a machine being able to store a programed sequence in random access memory and using thumbwheels to tell it what to do. But I am not a patent lawyer and we all know lawyers use 50 sentences to say the meaning of one word.
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Old June 26th, 2011, 11:41 AM   #22 (permalink)
srimonogramming srimonogramming is offline
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by RWB
Ask your "cousin" to define "prior art" in other countries -and- how that might effect the enforceability of a US Patent ???
You mean "affect"? The fact the machine was made in Poland hasn't stopped the enforceability of prior patent infringement cases has it? Anatol being an example.
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Old June 26th, 2011, 11:54 AM   #23 (permalink)
RWB RWB is offline
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by srimonogramming
You mean "affect"? The fact the machine was made in Poland hasn't stopped the enforceability of prior patent infringement cases has it? Anatol being an example.
Nope ... effect (as in special)


First, a person is not entitled to a patent if the invention was "known or used by others in this country, or was patented or described in a printed publication in this or a foreign country" before the date of invention by the applicant for the patent. If, for example, an invention is known or is being used by someone in the United States, another person who makes the same invention at a later date may not obtain a patent. Prior knowledge or use in a different country, however, is not a bar to a patent application in the United States. In contrast, a prior patent or a printed publication anywhere in the world will bar an applicant for patent in the United States if it appeared before the date of the applicant's invention.
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Old June 26th, 2011, 07:48 PM   #24 (permalink)
Promo Print Promo Print is offline
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by preston
I read the patent and if you can even make sense of the gooblygoc wording used I never saw one thing about revolving. The only thing I saw was about a machine being able to store a programed sequence in random access memory and using thumbwheels to tell it what to do. But I am not a patent lawyer and we all know lawyers use 50 sentences to say the meaning of one word.
That is what is puzzling me.
If it is program only, than nothing stops me for writing my own program. It is not that I went to memory of M&R machine and steal their program.
If patent is on whole motion (process of printing), question is could they do it as that process has been used much more before M&R.
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Old June 26th, 2011, 09:16 PM   #25 (permalink)
preston preston is offline
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by Promo Print
That is what is puzzling me.
If it is program only, than nothing stops me for writing my own program. It is not that I went to memory of M&R machine and steal their program.
If patent is on whole motion (process of printing), question is could they do it as that process has been used much more before M&R.
The process of printing in a revolver like sequence has been done long before the patent was filed for so the process is common knowledge and cannot be patented. So yes (again I am not a high paid thief (I mean lawyer)) but I would say it would just cover the program and the steps the operator would use to instruct it what to do.


It is like back when the Wrights sued Curtis because he put ailerons on his planes. The Wrights had patented wing warping as a method of controlling a planes banking direction. Ailerons performed the same function but with movable hinged sections of the wing instead of warping. After a lot of lawyer fees over the years it was determined that you could not patent the fact that you could make a plane bank left or right just the process by which to do it. After all people had seen birds do it forever so the function was common knowledge. I would think the same would apply with this.
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Old June 26th, 2011, 10:26 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by Promo Print
That is what is puzzling me.
If it is program only, than nothing stops me for writing my own program. It is not that I went to memory of M&R machine and steal their program.
If patent is on whole motion (process of printing), question is could they do it as that process has been used much more before M&R.
I believe you would be able to write your own program and use it. What you can not due is packge it a sell it similar to what is pat.
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Old June 26th, 2011, 10:34 PM   #27 (permalink)
Spider-Machines Spider-Machines is offline
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by jmd
I believe you would be able to write your own program and use it. What you can not due is packge it a sell it similar to what is pat.
Not true ... If he infringes on a Patent he is liable ... even if you make a homemade widget out of 2 x 4 's if it infringes on a Patent then you can be sued (prior art is the answer to ALL M&R Patents)
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Old June 26th, 2011, 10:41 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by jmd
I believe you would be able to write your own program and use it. What you can not due is packge it a sell it similar to what is pat.
And that is what I am trying to get to bottom of- what exactly Revolver patent is????
If program is patent, I can write program in different program language that is not used to be stored in PLC memory. In that case I don't see reason why not I would be able to sell even if it does same function.
If patent is function of that program, than my question is is it possible to patent such thing as that technique has been used long before that program.
That would be same if Microsoft would patent Microsoft Office and no one have right to write text editing program.
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Old June 26th, 2011, 10:47 PM   #29 (permalink)
jmd jmd is offline
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by Spider-Machines
Not true ... If he infringes on a Patent he is liable ... even if you make a homemade widget out of 2 x 4 's if it infringes on a Patent then you can be sued (prior art is the answer to ALL M&R Patents)
sued for what, he did not sell it. what would the suite worth?
like did you ever tape an NFL game for yourself...same thing
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Old June 26th, 2011, 10:50 PM   #30 (permalink)
jmd jmd is offline
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Default Re: Revolver mode

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Originally Posted by Promo Print
And that is what I am trying to get to bottom of- what exactly Revolver patent is????
If program is patent, I can write program in different program language that is not used to be stored in PLC memory. In that case I don't see reason why not I would be able to sell even if it does same function.
If patent is function of that program, than my question is is it possible to patent such thing as that technique has been used long before that program.
That would be same if Microsoft would patent Microsoft Office and no one have right to write text editing program.
If you are looking to do something for in house use that is one thing, but if your intentions are to go out and sell the product your best bet is to hire a patent attorny. After they do their research they will be able to tell you exactly what not to do.
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