T2 What is the widest you will digitize a Satin stitch?

Robert Young · January 13th, 2017, 01:02 PM

I typically only go to 8mm wide but some of my clients are fine with half an inch (12.2mm) I just worry about those wide satins getting snagged and coming out... or if the embroiderer has tensions set too tight those wide satins could pucker or gather the fabric.

What are your rules for wide satins? When would you switch to a bendable fill or ceeding? Or just go with an actual fill with or without a border?

digidana · January 13th, 2017, 06:13 PM

depending on what its going on (if it could get snagged, etc.), i try to stay 6mm or under for a satin. i like the bendable fill (i call it turn fill), but i won't use it on stitch groups that make tight turns like a donut or S shape. it gets too tight on the inside of the turns. i usually use it for more decorative stuff...not typically for company logos. here's a cobra i'm working on now where i'm using it (don't judge...its not done yet).

even tho the snake makes a couple of sharp turns, i did the turn fill in several stitch groups so that none of them actually make the sharp turn. no fabric holes, and gives it more dimension.

i almost never do a fill without either a satin or running stitch border. use satin stitches when/whereever possible. not crazy about the running stitches, but on more complicated, or smaller designs like this one they're necessary.

of course there are exceptions to every rule.

minimalist · January 13th, 2017, 07:13 PM

Depends on the fabric and item but never above 3/8". Anything that might be subject to wear gets a decorative pattern step. The exception to this are the curly and vines type monograms on kids shirts. I even use DPS on the curly and vines on women's shirts. I really try to avoid using satin period. It has it's place for small lettering or withing complicated designs.

I've had people bring towels in that other embroiders did and want me to fix them. They're puzzled by my response that it would be cheaper to buy another towel let me do it right.

digidana · January 14th, 2017, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minimalist

never above 3/8". Anything that might be subject to wear gets a decorative pattern step. I even use DPS on the curly and vines on women's shirts. I really try to avoid using satin period. It has it's place for small lettering or withing complicated designs.

3/8" = 9.53 millimeters? is that right? that seems really wide to me. what are you calling a decorative pattern step? i've not heard that term before. i can't imagine avoiding satin stitches...i use them all the time.

minimalist · January 16th, 2017, 02:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by digidana

3/8" = 9.53 millimeters? is that right? that seems really wide to me. what are you calling a decorative pattern step? i've not heard that term before. i can't imagine avoiding satin stitches...i use them all the time.

Oops I meant 3/16 of an inch. I use compucon EOS. In my software I have what they call special step in which I can vary the numbers in rows of columns creating a pattern. There are also some 300 decorative type stitches I can choose from in a different setting. I have Wilcom E2 level 3 too but have not yet learned to use it.

I've seen too many items in which the satin gets snagged and starts unraveling. What I've done is apply the other methods to items that are subject to wear or washing to mitigate the issue with using a satin stitch.

jarmenta · January 17th, 2017, 12:19 AM

Anything over 6mm wide, I tend to lean towards going with a satin fill (ceeding) stitch, but use a longer stitch length. It lays down enough staggered needle penetrations to reduce snagging, but isn't so dense that there are problems with the inside curves like Digidana referred to.

ltpemb · January 29th, 2017, 03:35 PM

As a rule I stick to 5-6mm or less, then depending on the artwork/desire and opinion of the client I will change the stitch type around But Its never "I always use this or that" it usually is driven by the customer/the artwork/ and What I think will look best for them.

That said I have done MUCH larger satin stitches up to 12mm or so. But I usually require a heavy fabric that wont pucker easily. I then use dense tatami underlay (not as dense as a full fill but darn close) and either a double zigzag or a second tatami. This serves to anchor the fabric against puckering and will create a backup if the top satin buckles a little or moves while being worn you don't see fabric you just see more white stitching.

I have also done one other thing for fun but not in practice. This requires less underlay but does change the appearance of the top satin stitch ever so slightly. I have used it to create subtle vehicle textures in the past.
Basically you create your wide satin stitch column. then on top of that you turn off all underlay and being mindful of your stop/start points create another column satin stitch of the same color and angle that is half as wide. Significantly more subtle than splitting up the satin stitch because the angle is the same the stitches fall between the previous satin more and create a relatively smoother end result because the underneath satin stitches are still continuous. Saying that I now might try this same technique with the first layer splitting and than creating a top stitch that covers the split with a deep edgerun underlay that keeps the top stitch from falling into the split but has the ends of the top stitch smoothly between the satin... interesting. Putting that on my list of experiments.

I have also used this technique when running on fill stitches of machinery artwork where everything is pretty much the same color but there are many layers of depth in the structural details. the non-underlayed satin sinks into the fill creating a subtle depth, and then on top edgerun-underlayed satin stands above that layer creating the 3 layers of depth with the same color.

ltpemb · January 29th, 2017, 03:41 PM

As for outlining Fill stitches. Case by case basis. sometimes I just use fill stitches with underlay controls set to maintain a lofted cleaner edge.

digidana · January 30th, 2017, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltpemb

Basically you create your wide satin stitch column. then on top of that you turn off all underlay and being mindful of your stop/start points create another column satin stitch of the same color and angle that is half as wide. Significantly more subtle than splitting up the satin stitch because the angle is the same the stitches fall between the previous satin more and create a relatively smoother end result because the underneath satin stitches are still continuous. Saying that I now might try this same technique with the first layer splitting and than creating a top stitch that covers the split with a deep edgerun underlay that keeps the top stitch from falling into the split but has the ends of the top stitch smoothly between the satin... interesting. Putting that on my list of experiments.

i'm not sure i follow on this....can you post a pic maybe? have you ever tried using two satins, side-by-side, overlapping with a jagged stitch on both on the inside? i may have for say, animals, but might try stitching it out to see how it works for a wider lettering just to play...

ltpemb · February 2nd, 2017, 01:44 PM

I did a test real quick sewout and test and the first method I described didn't work quite right after wear but the idea I came up with while writing the first post stands up better.