First machine arrives Monday, what else do I need?

Robert Young · November 15th, 2012, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PTEGolf

Also, we want to be able to do flags, but can't have the backing showing on the other side. From what I understand, I will need to purchase blank bobbins and wind them myself somehow? with the same color we are using at the time, so the design looks the same on the back? Do I not use backing at all then? This would be on 400D Nylon.

Sewing with the same color bobbin as the top color will give you a similar result on the backside... from a distance. But look at any embroidery you have.. the satins on the top side are nice and smooth.. now look at the backside.. you will see the satin is in 3 parts...not smooth..(the center part is your bobbin) . if it weren't nylon you could crank up your bobbin tension and create just a seam down the middle of every satin on the back, but still wont be pretty up close.

So I guess it just depends on how picky your client is about what they see on the back?

minimalist · November 15th, 2012, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inkman996

Why is a magnetic bobbin a "solution looking for a problem"?

Before we switched from card board backed bobbins we ran into sewing issues when the bobbin got near the end, with the magnetics the tension remains the same from the beginning to the end of the spool, so quality never changes.

So, there is no variance in the strength of the magnet or the tightness of how the bobbin is wound? Can the magnet adjust it's pull from start to finish since it will be spinning faster at the beginning than the end of the bobbin? There will be a point where the optimum pull of the magnet and spin of the bobbin would be most effective. When a machine stops abruptly the standard bobbin on a machine keeps spinning slightly. That is why the backlash spring is there. It minimizes the effect of the spin after the machine stops. Metal on metal contact (standard bobbin) with lubrication will cause the bobbin to spin slightly after the machine stops. That is how sewing machines are engineered. This occurs with no sided, cardboard sided, plastic sided, metal, and even magnetic.

Tension of the bobbin is determined by the tension adjustment of the bobbin case as well as how tightly the bobbin is would. If a bobbin is wound correctly the tension will remain roughly the same through the pull of the bobbin simply because it slows down when the core gets smaller. I have found on barudan machines that the finger holding the hook basket has to be centered with the needle. If not that causes extreme tension problems.

Does filtec make a nice magnetic bobbin, sure. Do I want to pay $30 for a box of bobbins, no. When we run patterns I record how many we can do before bobbin changes. Then we pull the bobbins before they run out and replace them when putting a item back on the machine. I toss them with some thread still on it. Saves me time and money especially on hats.

You've got your way and I've got mine. Neither is wrong. The industry techs state that the tension is correct in the bobbin when you hold the thread and dangle the bobbin while moving the thread up and down that the case should move down slightly with each movement up and down. I ignore that and run it slightly tighter to make a tighter stitch. I also run the take up spring tighter than most to minimize looping.

It's all about preference. I did leather manufacturing for 20 years before getting into embroidery so I have some experience with sewing machines.

inkman996 · November 15th, 2012, 11:29 AM

We ran card board for many years and always suffered stitch quality if the bobbins were allowed to near the end. And we suffered back spin.

Once switching to magnetic stitching quality was 100% till the end of the bobbin and the machine will stop and alert. Never once has my operator complained of back spin since switching.

Yes we both have our ways, the OP asked which is more head ache free regardless of $$. My answer is magnetic bobbins and it is true. Maybe I am stepping on your toes because you are also trying to sell card board sided bobbins, sorry but that is not the purpose of this forum especially when the OP wanted an honest answer.

As for techs and their opinion, we employ a tech once a year and all praise the magnetic bobbin over the old card board ones.

Yes emb machines are designed to work the way you described, magnetic bobbins do not take away from that they enhance the performance of the bobbin.

minimalist · November 15th, 2012, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inkman996

We ran card board for many years and always suffered stitch quality if the bobbins were allowed to near the end. And we suffered back spin.

Once switching to magnetic stitching quality was 100% till the end of the bobbin and the machine will stop and alert. Never once has my operator complained of back spin since switching.

Yes we both have our ways, the OP asked which is more head ache free regardless of $$. My answer is magnetic bobbins and it is true. Maybe I am stepping on your toes because you are also trying to sell card board sided bobbins, sorry but that is not the purpose of this forum especially when the OP wanted an honest answer.

As for techs and their opinion, we employ a tech once a year and all praise the magnetic bobbin over the old card board ones.

Yes emb machines are designed to work the way you described, magnetic bobbins do not take away from that they enhance the performance of the bobbin.

I guess the sewing industry as a whole couldn't function right for 100 years before the magic of magnetic bobbins? Shame on me for mentioning I sell thread. I'll check with you first next time since your experience and tech obviously take precedence over any other opinion.

inkman996 · November 15th, 2012, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minimalist

I guess the sewing industry as a whole couldn't function right for 100 years before the magic of magnetic bobbins? Shame on me for mentioning I sell thread. I'll check with you first next time since your experience and tech obviously take precedence over any other opinion.

I like the attitude.

Lets make this point extra clear for you.

THE OP ASKED FOR THE BEST BOBBIN TYPE TO USE without regard to the cost. I told him magnetic because it will give him the least head aches.

You tho seem to feel he should have the same knowledge and experience as you and be able to run card board sided bobbins as well as you can.

Again OP wanted to know the best bobbin for the money not what someones resume is.

Me being a real world embroider for 15 years on large machines think i have the right to tell him what has worked better for us, as a production based embroidery business.

minimalist · November 15th, 2012, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inkman996

I like the attitude.

Lets make this point extra clear for you.

THE OP ASKED FOR THE BEST BOBBIN TYPE TO USE without regard to the cost. I told him magnetic because it will give him the least head aches.

You tho seem to feel he should have the same knowledge and experience as you and be able to run card board sided bobbins as well as you can.

Again OP wanted to know the best bobbin for the money not what someones resume is.

Me being a real world embroider for 15 years on large machines think i have the right to tell him what has worked better for us, as a production based embroidery business.

By all means do so. You've stated your opinion exhibiting the attitude first my friend.

TO the OP, ask your Barudan guy which bobbins hesuggest that you use.

xxyybeth · June 29th, 2013, 12:47 AM

Hair Dye

Sorry, after 15+ years of Been~There~Done~That, I couldn't resist

Sincere Congrats!

Best Wishes for short learning curve and light speed up and running without issue.

Personally, in my region, I found out what you need to know the hard EXPENSIVE way. I pray you're spared the on-going aggravation I've endured the last 15+ years.

Please know, on-going declining embroidery market and start-up cost is incidental if you put a price on your time to gain skill and knowledge required to function cost effectively competitively.

In my area, Would you like Fries With That, Pays Better.

I sincerely hope you have a huge embroidery market that supports your new embroidery business.

Sincere Best Wishes for Huge Success!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by PTEGolf

Hello All,

Long story short we've been outsourcing embroidery for 9 years and finally decided to buy our own machine to better control the time frames, quality, and to expand our business. I don't know the first thing about running an embroidery machine, but I've been around them. I'm wondering what else we need to buy?

The machine will come with the hoops, but that's about it. How do I know what tear-away to buy (oz), what bobbins, what hooping board, etc?

We will mainly be sewing on 600D Polyester backed by a PVC Coating. The embroidery is almost always 15"x15" or around there within a couple inches.

I signed up with Madiera USA to buy my thread, but that's basically where I am. I did visit a couple local companies and watch how they do it, but never got a list of things to buy for the first time? Is there a guide out there anyone would recommend?

Also, I hired the Barudan rep to do training with me at $500/day for 1 or 2 days when it arrives.

Thanks!

Thoroughbred · June 29th, 2013, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PTEGolf

Hello All,

Long story short we've been outsourcing embroidery for 9 years and finally decided to buy our own machine to better control the time frames, quality, and to expand our business. I don't know the first thing about running an embroidery machine, but I've been around them. I'm wondering what else we need to buy?

The machine will come with the hoops, but that's about it. How do I know what tear-away to buy (oz), what bobbins, what hooping board, etc?

We will mainly be sewing on 600D Polyester backed by a PVC Coating. The embroidery is almost always 15"x15" or around there within a couple inches.

I signed up with Madiera USA to buy my thread, but that's basically where I am. I did visit a couple local companies and watch how they do it, but never got a list of things to buy for the first time? Is there a guide out there anyone would recommend?

Also, I hired the Barudan rep to do training with me at $500/day for 1 or 2 days when it arrives.

Thanks!

Okay, we use Madeira occasionally, but for us (19 years) King Star Thread (Japan) is the way to go. Hard to find (The Embroidery Store), but the finished look is the best, very few thread breaks and our customers have loved the finished product for a long time.

xxyybeth · June 29th, 2013, 10:16 AM

Know that no matter what type of bobbin you use the design on back will never be Visually appealing unless you're doing simple Ball or something like that. Backside/underside sew out is flipped/reversed, it will never look correct. Text/Verbiage will not READ Left to Right, it will always be Right to Left.

Piece Work is an option, make Two Flags and assemble/Sew together, both sides are then identical, but know each side reads Left to Right, could be an issue for some, One-Sided Banners are more suitable if that's the case.

Have you shopped Flags and Banners? Last 10 years, DTG equipment and market infilltration of Suppliers, even on eBay, Custom Banners and Flags are DIRT CHEAP these days. Depending on Size of Flags difficult to compete with On Line Market, especially NEVER if a One-Off.

Now, RE: Bobbins
I began using Magnetic Bobbins, about 2 years ago. My machine uses the large M Size, I love them. I sure hope I never have to go back to Cardboard Sided.
Benefits outweigh extra cost. CONSISTANT feed, less thread breaks and less fuss time loss with Upper and Lower tension. OMG, I haven't had need to run a "H" Tension since I began use. Just make sure all top Threads are Taught and Good to Go. I do a drop test to make sure Bobbin Thread spools offf farily loose, then good-to-go.
And yes, machine has an alarm that alerts/stops if bobbin runs out.
No worry, Stop and change over to new bobbin is incidental loss of time compared to benefits, at least with my machine.
If running a large Stitch Count, over 100,000 stitches, (large flags have large stictch count)etc. and plan to walk off, leave machine unattended afraid your bobbin is going to run out is the least of your concerns. Large Sash Hoops or other Large Clamped Hoops etc. all need a baby-sit, it's NOT GET RICH QUICK, machine always needs a full-time operator to baby-sitter to Prevent and Fix Murphy's Law.

I've Never ran Pre-Wound Metal Bobbins, never experimented with Metal to Metal at high Speed has anybody else?
Have no clue on metal bobbin cases for embroidery machine, only use the metal bobbins for upholstery walking foot machine, they're perfect for that. We run the Cardboard sided on our Double Needle Walking Foot, they work great, save so much time over using the winder on-board machine, Two at once are changed out.
With the Upholstery Sewing Machines, we mainly use same color bobbin Top and Bottom on rare projects we use Clear Nylon, that stuff works great for respooling your fishing reel as well:-) We rarely have a NEED for it.

I personally would be interested in knowing best source for low cost size M magnetic bobbins these days. My former Supplier for same has goine out of business. Same for Hollingsworth 100/200 yard rolls of backing, My Stash is dwindeling (-:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Young

Sewing with the same color bobbin as the top color will give you a similar result on the backside... from a distance. But look at any embroidery you have.. the satins on the top side are nice and smooth.. now look at the backside.. you will see the satin is in 3 parts...not smooth..(the center part is your bobbin) . if it weren't nylon you could crank up your bobbin tension and create just a seam down the middle of every satin on the back, but still wont be pretty up close.

So I guess it just depends on how picky your client is about what they see on the back?

minimalist · July 2nd, 2013, 04:48 PM

xxyybeth,

Metal bobbins have been in use since the sewing machine was invented. I ran a leather manufacturing business for 20 years before getting into embroidery. We ran metal that were wound by the machine being used. A consew industrial automatic bobbin winder using metal bobbins would equate to using prewound bobbins. Since the cost of those is between 2K and 3K and the chinese knockoffs being of questionable quality many shops will not have one. We did not have one in the leather business due to the large machine's bobbins could not be wound by the automatic bulk winder.